Poaching Someones Permission

[Iron Mask]

This is just a thread where I would like to have some opinions and it is not meant as a question that I need help with nor will others opinions change my approach or my opinion about the topic.
In my opinion it is an unwritten rule or detecting etiquette that one must not poach permission that one is sure another person, club or organization has been given. If the permission has been rightfully revoked or expired then it is a different story. I say rightfully revoked meaning that the permission was revoked because the general code of conduct was broken. I don’t mean revoked because someone came along and bought off the land owner that eventually revoked the original permission.
I personally think it is selfish and disrespectful to even consider poaching a permission.
Just my opinion .
What is yours?

[David H]

Firstly in my opinion, the land we detect isnt ours nor do we have any say in who visits it, thats a decision for the land owner to make. Recently been to Cornwall for a holiday, spent a few hours in the mornings going round farms asking for permision to detect. After 3 attempts found permision and found a hammy.( with se pro not my Deus) The point being i havent a clue if anyone else detects there, though the lack of buttons and buckles indicated that detectors had most probably been over it. The farmer himself had an uncanny knowledge of hammereds !

If someone else was detecting there, i wouldnt consider myself poaching his land. Up here in Brecon and areas in Monmouthshire i have permision on approx 40 farms ( most of whom are customers ) in a life time could never realistically cover all the ground. If any of the land owners allow others to detect, best of luck to them. I might hire a hit man if like a few years ago when a hoard of axe heads were found thats life !

The word ' poaching ' is a bit strong and loaded, unless you are referring to those who detect without permission. Thats a different story !

[Homestansted]

How do you know if the land has anyone detecting on it? I shoot over thousands of acres and now have permission to detect over them I don't know if there detectorists on the land already should I ask and then not go if he says yes?

It would take many life times to do a fraction of the land I have even with my trainers on and deus!

I'm a retained fireman and have to detect within a short distance from the station when I'm on call so the land I can do the most on has to be close to the station, what am I to do?

[Steve_T]

The answer to the question as I personally see it….. Would I seek to obtain permission on land knowingly that others detect on and have done for years my option would be no I wouldn’t...But that’s my take on the matter.

[Iron Mask]

Firstly in my opinion, the land we detect isnt ours nor do we have any say in who visits it, thats a decision for the land owner to make. Recently been to Cornwall for a holiday, spent a few hours in the mornings going round farms asking for permision to detect. After 3 attempts found permision and found a hammy.( with se pro not my Deus) The point being i havent a clue if anyone else detects there, though the lack of buttons and buckles indicated that detectors had most probably been over it. The farmer himself had an uncanny knowledge of hammereds !

If someone else was detecting there, i wouldnt consider myself poaching his land. Up here in Brecon and areas in Monmouthshire i have permision on approx 40 farms ( most of whom are customers ) in a life time could never realistically cover all the ground. If any of the land owners allow others to detect, best of luck to them. I might hire a hit man if like a few years ago when a hoard of axe heads were found thats life !

The word ' poaching ' is a bit strong and loaded, unless you are referring to those who detect without permission. Thats a different story !

“not poach permission that another person, club or organization has been given.”
Obviously if you are not aware of any permission granted then for sure you have all the right to ask. And in the case were the land owner may tell you that others have permission as he is not going to give sole permission. But what about when you have been invited on a dig, should you go to the landowner and try to get permission on that same land? Or you see someone often on a field so you may think the land owner is OK with detecting, should you approach the land owner and try to get permission that you are 90% sure someone else already has?

[Iron Mask]

How do you know if the land has anyone detecting on it? I shoot over thousands of acres and now have permission to detect over them I don't know if there detectorists on the land already should I ask and then not go if he says yes?

It would take many life times to do a fraction of the land I have even with my trainers on and deus!

I'm a retained fireman and have to detect within a short distance from the station when I'm on call so the land I can do the most on has to be close to the station, what am I to do?

I changed the wording a bit. I meant to say if you are aware that someone has permission.

[dave9]

I for one would not poach anyones permissions .I do have shared permission on a lot of land but we tend to keep to our own area.Many people could not give two hoots though.They see some people detecting,go and ask the owner ,if he says no they come back at night or even day.I have many thousands of acres to go at and always ask for a few mates as well but never mussel in on anyones patch.

[Tony Hunt]

Fair enough in a situation like that dave where you probably hardly ever visit some of those farms anyway. 10-12 years ago I decided to share my permission at Norden farm Corfe because it was such an ideal site with the campsite on the farm. It was perfect for a club meeting place for MLO so I asked the farmer for permission to do so which he readily agreed to. Over those years one or two other local people have always had permission but none of them tend to visit very often so everybody has been happy. Like scotty says for somebody from the same club to go and get personal permission for himself and his mates when he knows that club makes regular visits as a meeting place is going to rankle a bit. He's probably used the fact that he's a member here and a regular to get his permission from the farmer anyway.
I had several messages of support in my mail this morning once again so others are thinking along the same lines and none are very happy with the situation. Not a way to make friends thats for sure.

[Homestansted]

Well I will ask the farmers if they have granted anyone else permission, and then try and speak to the other detectorists.

Some of the ground I have done is completely riddled with buttons and small pieces of lead so if they have got permission and go on those fields I might need to check there settings or lend them a shovel.

[Homestansted]

I think this subject needs to be thought about very carefully, I asked permission on an estate the other day 5 mins up the road, large estate, they said "o no we have the game keeper do that stuff on our land".
I Asked a friend who lives on the estate, he said the game keeper has got a metal detector only ever seen him out once with it in the 15 years he has lived on the estate!

SHOULD I HAVE ASKED PERMISSION?

[Iron Mask]

I think this subject needs to be thought about very carefully, I asked permission on an estate the other day 5 mins up the road, large estate, they said "o no we have the game keeper do that stuff on our land".
I Asked a friend who lives on the estate, he said the game keeper has got a metal detector only ever seen him out once with it in the 15 years he has lived on the estate!

SHOULD I HAVE ASKED PERMISSION?

Sure you should ask permission if you are not aware of anyone having permission. And if you know someone has permission any rarely use it then approach the person who has the permission and maybe you get yourself a new detecting mate and more permission.
Ask permission but don't try to poach it or muscle it away from someone whom has it and uses it. There are many reasonable ways around it.
That is my opinion.

[Jake-festina]

Knowingly poaching someone land in my option is wrong,but as they say there is no honour amongst thieves, but this thread really isn't about that is it! It's about somebody going on the corfe land, again in my book wrong,but to vilify someone in an open thread is no more than a kangaroo court or witch hunt based a lot on a personal dislike I guess ,so come on folks don't make this very informative forum anymore clicky

[Tony Hunt]

The guy openly bragged on forum that he was going there jake thats why I replied about it being wrong, he hung himself.

[jcmaloney]

Depends how someone gained permission really. If a friend invited them onto their permission & they then waft ££££`s under the farmers nose to go on then that is VERY low.
From a dig organisers view we organise Club digs on land that others might have permission on but we only use & pay for it for the day. We don`t ask for sole rights or expect them.
The Club Farms are, however, a different prospect....the Club look after the farmers & their land FOR THE BENEFIT of the members and we have signed,sole access.

PS........I think Scott is reffering to land in Lincs....not Corfe!

[Jake-festina]

The guy openly bragged on forum that he was going there jake thats why I replied about it being wrong, he hung himself.

Maybe so but is there a need for a witch hunt? I do feel thought there are those in the click and those who aren't, and the click knows how to band together to and hunt as a pack, it is a shame that such a good forum is used in this way,but ah as a none click member my options aren't really that important

[Iron Mask]

Knowingly poaching someone land in my option is wrong,but as they say there is no honour amongst thieves, but this thread really isn't about that is it! It's about somebody going on the corfe land, again in my book wrong,but to vilify someone in an open thread is no more than a kangaroo court or witch hunt based a lot on a personal dislike I guess ,so come on folks don't make this very informative forum anymore clicky

Hello Jake
It is about what I called the thread title. I got the idea because of the related post in the Deus thread that went off topic and I won’t deny that. Really hit a soft spot because many of us really look forward to the Corfe meeting and some of us spend a lot of money to get there and enjoy it. We all know that it has been hit hard over the years and the main attraction is the gathering but there is that thought in the back of your mind that great finds come up every year and something might just come up next year. The detecting is a bonus and finding something is a greater bonus. But when you think that your odds are significantly less you are not so excited and that is human nature.
I don’t care who is doing the poaching whether it be on of the clicky people you mention or a complete stranger, in my opinion it is selfish and disrespectful.
You actually connected the two threads and many others may not have connected them if they have no interest in the Deus thread. It is nothing to do with like or dislike , more so trust and respect.

[Iron Mask]

Depends how someone gained permission really. If a friend invited them onto their permission & they then waft ££££`s under the farmers nose to go on then that is VERY low.
From a dig organisers view we organise Club digs on land that others might have permission on but we only use & pay for it for the day. We don`t ask for sole rights or expect them.
The Club Farms are, however, a different prospect....the Club look after the farmers & their land FOR THE BENEFIT of the members and we have signed,sole access.

PS........I think Scott is reffering to land in Lincs....not Corfe!

Another example JC.

[appsm]

I had such a case recently where a new local club decided to arrange a rally on land which they knew was club land of my club.Although the farmer agreed as has been said above it is not the done thing. It has now been sorted but it doesn't foster good relationships between detectorists or clubs.

[Jake-festina]

Hello Jake
It is about what I called the thread title. I got the idea because of the related post in the Deus thread that went off topic and I won’t deny that. Really hit a soft spot because many of us really look forward to the Corfe meeting and some of us spend a lot of money to get there and enjoy it. We all know that it has been hit hard over the years and the main attraction is the gathering but there is that thought in the back of your mind that great finds come up every year and something might just come up next year. The detecting is a bonus and finding something is a greater bonus. But when you think that your odds are significantly less you are not so excited and that is human nature.
I don’t care who is doing the poaching whether it be on of the clicky people you mention or a complete stranger, in my opinion it is selfish and disrespectful.
You actually connected the two threads and many others may not have connected them if they have no interest in the Deus thread. It is nothing to do with like or dislike , more so trust and respect.

Like I've said before its wrong poaching,I can see corfe is a very big deal to you and others,I have never been and I don't intended to,but please be honest this thread at its core was started with a barb on it,the noble spirit of trust and respect is what most would love to live by! So does all this washing have to be done in public,I think not,

[GaryBrun]

Maybe so but is there a need for a witch hunt? I do feel thought there are those in the click and those who aren't, and the click knows how to band together to and hunt as a pack, it is a shame that such a good forum is used in this way,but ah as a none click member my options aren't really that important

HI Jake.
Explain the click thing... because that bit I dont get.
How have you been made to think this is a "clicky thing"??

I can understand if you have never been to Corfe and think that your outside of the loop!

[Homestansted]

Ok sorry.

I took it to heart, being new to this, every farm has been approached on a regular basis so anyone new to detecting is going to struggle to get permissions.

And the last thing we all want is to force new comers under ground to the illegal side NIGHT HAWKING

[Jake-festina]

HI Jake.
Explain the click thing... because that bit I dont get.
How have you been made to think this is a "clicky thing"??

I can understand if you have never been to Corfe and think that your outside of the loop!

You have a pm leader

[GaryBrun]

You have a pm leader

And so do you...

[omegamike]

I have several farms, two of which I'm the ONLY detectorist with permission to detect. I know for fact that these two farms offices get regular visitors/phone calls asking for permission to detect. They are just told politely 'No'. I see no problem with people approaching farms asking for permission even if they are aware detectorists already work the land or not. What I would have a problem with is if a guest I invited along for a days detecting went out of his/her way to ask for permission using their 'guest' status as leverage to gain permission. What I said is neither here nor there as all my farms, bar one, don't allow guests, and this farm is solely mine to detect!. I've not actually got round to taking a guest to this farm yet as the fields are not yet ploughed and the farmer is only allowing permission for guests to detect a few particular fields.
The sad thing is that if you have a 'guest' who comes off a field with a pocket full or Roman or perhaps a Celtic or Hammy or three then the temptation must be great to go out of their way and try to secure permission themselves - not a nice thing to do but I understand why they would want to do this!! Some folk would sell their granny to get some decent productive land even at the cost of losing a friend or two...

[mal]

I think Jake means "clique" meaning gang, faction, set, etc. Spellchecker not working.